Run-Down Forums

[mjsbossman]

Recently my coach told us that we would greatly benefit from running twice a day. He said to run 3-4 miles in the morning before we go to school. if at practice we are running 7-9 miles, how can runnig 3-4 miles at one time help us? Would it be good to run at a fast pace on my morning runs?

On Friday we had our Alumni meet, and I did ok. I came in 6th place out of the boys on our team, 9th overall. My time for the 2 mile course was 11:41, compared to my last year's time of 12:45. With about half a mile to go, my stomach began to burn very badly, I wasnt too out of breath, and my legs felt ok, its just my stomach that slowed me down. Is that how you all feel when you are in a race? Do I have weak abs or something?

BTW the winner of the race was the same guy who trains with Regina Jacobs, he kicked our butts. I had no clue he trained with her, but my highschool is in Oakland, which is where Regina lives as well.

[Dan]

If your body can handle the increased workload, training twice a day will most likely help. It effectively trains you to develop a shorter recovery period, as well as some aerobic gains. A lot of people look at it as simply an easy way to increase mileage, but I think it can be made to be more than that with some creativity.

That's a good improvement over last year's time. It's pretty common to experience stomach burning when running hard, especially in early season hard workouts or races. Probably just a sign that you aren't yet accustomed to running that hard.

Dan

[mjsbossman]

Thank you very much Dan. You know, the thing is that I could not speed up at the end of the race. I dont seem to have much of a kick right now. Would it be a bad idea to sneak in a few interval sessions few mornings a week without telling my coach? I would be able to do half mile repeats at my house. I have read in a book I have that inter val training can help you in your everyday disntace running. If thats the case, I will do anything I can to get better. I am determined to get in the top 5 for Varsity. My coach said everyone in the top 5 need to run the 2 mile in 11 minutes flat. Dan, at this point in the early season, with meets still a few weeks away, what lenght of intervals would you reccomend?

[Dan]

I'm all for intervals and speed work, but I wouldn't go behind your coach's back to do it. Tell him/her what you think you need and why, and they should be reasonable enough to work it into your training.

I can think of several scenarios in which not telling coach would backfire...

800m, 1200m, and possibly 1600m repeats would serve you well, plus 100m-200m strides.

Dan

[mjsbossman]

How can this type of training backfire? Is there a chance I can get injured? I dont know, I am pretty strong, I have never gotten any type of injury, except blisters. Or can it make me peak to soon? Last Track season, I was improving up to the middle of the season, then my times started to get slower and slower, and I felt worse and worse in the races-I think my base was poor.

[Dan]

The type of training isn't what runs the risk of backfiring, it's not communicating with your coach. When communication breaks down between coach and athlete, it will invariably lead to overtraining, undertraining, injury, unhappiness, or something similarly undesireable.

What type of training were you doing last season? It could be too little base, mis-timing your peak, or even overtraining.

Dan

[mjsbossman]

Are these runs I will be doing 4-5 days a week help that much? Would it be beneficial to run them at a medium or hard pace? Or should they be at an easy 8 minute pace? Or should I vary it? I have onee last question. If we havea hard practice, should I do my second run of the day hard or easy? And if we have an easy practice, should I run easy on my second run?

I practice from 3:30PM to 5:30PM, then I will be doing my second run of the day later at night around 9-10PM.

Oh by the way Dan, last track season when I started doing bad, I think I know why. I had no base whatsoever. Then we started doing interval training and I cant even remember what happened. I had two consecutive good races, both were the same time (11:42). Then after that my times declined somehow.

[Dan]

Which runs are you referring to when you say 4-5 days a week? Varying the pace is always a good idea, if for no other reason than to avoid falling into a rut.

Two hard runs in a day does not sound wise. Two easy runs can be beneficial in terms of recovery, but two hard runs is likely to break your body down. If you can run hard a second time, you probably didn't run hard enough the first time...

Also, if you are running twice a day, it is best to have one in the morning and one in late afternoon. You are currently giving yourself about 4 hours between workouts, which is hardly enough time to get a meal in and digest, let alone recover.

Lack of base will get you every time!

Dan

[mjsbossman]

Thanks Dan...I said that I would run a second run (outside of practice, the morning runs) 4-5 days a week. I did plan on going at night time, but I suppose morning is a better way to do it. I talked to my coach and he said that I should just do a morning run on a hard practice day.

My coach said that some of the guys on Varsity need to get down to an 11 minute 2 mile (on our home course) and my time was 11:41. Any advice to drop that time quick? Back in the summer, I did some tempo runs, and those did make me get fast. But then I took 10 days off in the summer and I got slow again.

[Dan]

You won't be able to get there all at once, but I would try some 800 workouts. Do at least 4 of them, possibly as much as 8 (don't go beyond the point where the pace falters too much and you begin reinforcing bad mechanics), trying to get them down to 2:45 (5:30 mile pace, or 11:00 for 2 miles).

Dan

[mjsbossman]

Hey Dan, guess what? We just ran a practice meet at our home course (we split the whole team into 2 even teams), and I ran it in 10:45!!! I dont know what the heck happened. Two weeks ago I ran 11:41, and a year ago I ran 12:45.

Im thinking I ran fast because of many reasons...I had a good dinner the night before (Salmon, pasta, bread, salad), I got alot of sleep (9 hours, usually I get less than 7), I had nachos at lunch (I seem to run fast when I eat a fair amount of fat), and for the first time I used racing flats in a meet. Guess I'll have to do all that stuff on every race day.

[Dan]

Wow, that's an awesome improvement! Congratulations!!!

All of those prepatory items sound good, although the nachos seems a bit odd. Whatever works... Racing flats do make a huge difference if the footing is good enough to permit them.

Keep up the great work.

Dan

[mjsbossman]

Thanks Dan. My coach told me to go out fast, he said I wouldnt die because I have a good base. Oh well, whatever works.. Do you think the couple tempo runs I did worked?

[Dan]

They probably wouldn't have done anything for you in terms of conditioning (yet), but they certainly could have helped you mentally in several ways -- Knowing you are capable of running that pace and having run fast enough that you felt comforable running it.

Dan