Run-Down Forums

[Paul]

Do I detect a slight World Cross Country Championships dig there, Dan??

[Dan]

That and any other international meet of your choice.

Dan

[Micah Ward]

I often use a time/distance hybrid to break up the monotony of running regular routes. For example: I will run 60 minutes and I will start it by running a route that I know is 1 mile, noting my time, and I will come back and finish over that same mile, again noting the time. In between I just wander around following my nose. I can then average the first and last mile and divide that into the total time run to get a good idea of how far I ran.

[Paul]

Thanks, Micah, that is a good idea. I also liked the one from DG about having a measuring wheel to measure out courses off the beaten track if you didn't want to do all your intervals on the oval. Even though those devices aren't cheap, you have to figure they are going to last the rest of your life (hopefully).

[Paul]

Mike, if your were running your quarters from lane 4 you have to figure you were putting in 20 extra yards for each interval. Running 4 laps in lane 1 on a 400m track is only about 10 yards short of a mile.

Paul

[Dan]

Ah yes, that reminded me what we decided in a similar topic previously. If you want to run roughly a mile on a 400m track not marked for it, the spacing between the men's high hurdles marks is about right for the added distance. Find two such marks somewhere on the homestretch, start at the first of the two, and finish at the second of the two 4 laps later and you'll be very close to a mile.

If you don't have a measuring wheel handy or don't want to lug it around with you, just go to the track and count off steps over the 100m and see how consistent you can get. I have my steps calibrated almost exactly to one meter per, with 100 meters usually being covered in about +/- 0.2 steps (literally only a few inches off over that distance). I even eyeballed a hill I was running as 80m, then walked it off when I was done and was only off by half a step...

Dan

[training2run]

If you run on the track, you are able to record your workout by distance. This is difficult, but not impossible on roads (measure it with your bike).

On trails, it's about impossible to get an accurate distance, so you use time.

On a treadmill it's a cince to get accurate time *and* distance, but, unfortunately, it doesn't translate to the real world - you're not pushing yourself through the air.

To get over this hurdle, I use a treadmill at a 2% or 3% grade, and count it as running on the flat. Also, since I get so hot, I keep a couple of big fans blowing on me (maybe this gives a little wind resistance . Okay, maybe not !

Back at the Texas Medical Center, I burned out two treadmill motors doing varied hill workouts...now that's what I call fun ! Mad Dog Mike www.training2run.com

[Distance_Guru]

I used to do a lot of my workouts on treadmills. I actually found that I always got a good workout in. The reason was simple, I hate running on treadmills and so once I get started all I want to do is be done. So every time I ran on a treadmill at least half of every run was as fast as it could go. Unfortunatly that was only ten mph which was more than fast enough to give me a good workout but it was never fast enough when I wanted to get done.
_________________
Time is the fire in which we burn

[training2run]

Dear Guru: You're sure right, when you want to get it over with, it's never fast enough.

The one thing I loved about using the treadmill, was it faced a mirror. I could stare at myself, watch the sweat pouring off, and really "dig in."

I'd keep upping the speed, until the pulse rate monitor popped off, then I *really* dug in. I kept upping the speed, with the alarm ringing like h*ll, and I kept it up until I could go no further or the motor burned out.

All the above aside, it was still more difficult to run "for real" than it was to run on the treadmill.

Oh, yeh, one of the reason I used the treadmill in Florida, was to get out of the heat and humidity. Unfortunately, all the sweat pouring off me, rusted out my home unit in a very short time. Mad Dog Mike www.training2run.com

[Paul]

I dislike treadmill running myself because it is so tedious. I'm always playing around with the controls so it becomes like an interval workout. Last Fall I was doing a workout where I would warmup for 3 min at 5 mph on the treadmill and then go over to the Stepmill (which was a stair climbing device, but not the regular up and down kind, it was taller and had cascading stairs for you to step up on), and climb the stairs just as fast as I could for 2 minutes. Then I would quickly go back to the treadmill and do another 3 min at 5 mph. I would repeat this whole process 4-6 times. I figured it had to be like doing hard 400m intervals with a 400m jog between each. I have a gym membership at 24 Hr Fitness. They just got in the new Precor 950 which is a very solid, smooth operating treadmill. I'm assuming its a new model, anyway.

Paul

[training2run]

I know exactly what you mean, and I love playing with the controls.

When I'm on the treadmill, I'm constantly raising the speed higher and higher (6-7-8 mph), and changing the angle of incline, up and down, up and down, though I never go below 2%. Below two percent I feel like I'm falling forward, and keep running into the control panel.

The one I was using at the gym was a Precor also, but the one I had at home wasn't that heavy-duty, though it did have a power incline up to 10%, and went a lot faster than you'd want to go on a treadmill.

Step machines can be real killers, as you well know. I generally used the stepper after the treadmill - I didn't go back and forth as in your (impressive) workout. Mad Dog Mike www.training2run.com

[Paul]

Thanks, Mike. But believe me if you would have seen me on some of those workouts you would have been in stitches from laughing. I fell off the Stepmill a couple of times because I got so tired that I failed to pick up my feet high enough to make it to the next step and tripped!! I had to concentrate hard to keep my rhythm going. The stair machines can really put a muscular workout on your thighs and calves. The Precor at the gym I go to goes up to 12% and they have a number of Star Trac treadmills that go up to 15%. I have done a couple of min at 5 mph and 15%. That was tough. I've noticed many of the machines don't go much higher than 10 mph. I suppose if one really wants to go faster than 90 sec a quarter they should be out on the road or at a track. One thing I notice on the treadmill and definitely on the stair machines is I don't have that light gait feeling like I do when I'm running well outside.
I ran into a chart in a newsletter a couple of years ago that attempted to compare the equivalences between treadmill running and outside running pace based on the treadmill incline. This article also said you would have to set the incline to 1% to make up just the wind resistance of normal outside running.
Paul

[training2run]

Thanks, laughing just reading your note - I can really picture you falling off that thing. You know you're getting a great workout, when you begin to lose all coordination.

Training for one of the mountain trail races, I used to run 10 or 12 miles, then finish up at my friend Jim's Gym, where, without resting from the run, I would perform rounds of free-squats, leg-curls and leg-extensions for at least half an hour without pause, ending with the squat portion.

At the end of the final round I would continue doing the squats until I was unable to rise, and fell over on my side (like you falling off the stepper).

I'd grab a pole to pull myself upright, then slowly jog 2 1/2 miles home.

The treadmill I used at the Medical Center did, I believe, go up to 15% (like looking up the side of a sky scraper).

The one I had at home, even though it was only 10%, I blocked up the front end, so I guess I could get it up to 12% or a little steeper.

Running 10 mph on a treadmill can be scary! Here in central Mexico, where I now live and train, treadmills are not readily available - but hills are. I'm happy. Mad Dog Mike www.training2run.com

[Dan]

Not many people seem to agree with this, but I've always found my pace on a treadmill to be equivalent to a significantly faster pace effort-wise on the track or roads, maybe as much as 6 min/mile on the treadmill equalling 5 min/mile on the track. The reason being you can't really open up your stride for fear of clipping the front or slipping too far toward the back. As a result, my turnover looks like a hamster on a wheel...

I did a biomechanics impact test once on the treadmill, trying out various shoes with sensors wired all over. The treadmill maxed out at 10 mph, and they gradually raised my speed up to that with aquasocks on. After 30 or 60 seconds at that speed, they were going to slow the speed back down. Instead of slowing down, the machine came to an abrupt stop. Fortunately, I was in mid stride and was able to correct for that rapid "deceleration" and not slam into the front or hyperextend my knee on planting... The test controller was just as shocked as I was.

Dan

[training2run]

You have to run a minute a mile (or so faster) on the treadmill to get (more or less) the same benefit as running in the real world? If I'm reading your writing correctly, sounds like a good rule of thumb.

Must have shocked the p*ss out of you when the motor shut off...I usually keep the treadmill at a pretty good angle, so gravity helps (a little at least) to protect me from such mishaps.

Also, Dan, setting the machine at 2% or a little better, keeps you from moving forward, and allows you to "open up" your stride a bit more...at least I've found that to be the case. Mad Dog Mike www.training2run.com[url][/url]